[pmwiki-users] New Acme recipe...

Hans design5 at softflow.co.uk
Wed Apr 18 03:31:23 CDT 2007


Tuesday, April 17, 2007, 11:06:38 PM, The Editor wrote:

>> - What's the official status

> The code is quite functional and works well.  Most of it's commands
> are in full operation at ZAPsite in the snippets section. Feel free to
> take a look.  It's also quite well documented--now with numerous
> tutorials as well as an extensive developers section. Hans changed the
> status to beta for me because PmWiki is in beta status, and ZAP
> requires the latest beta versions.  Other than that it is quite
> stable.

There is no official status for PmWiki add-ons released in the cookbook
section. Pm does not take any responsibility for functionality or
security regards to theses scripts. I think it is up to us, as
a community of PmWiki users and recipe developers, to provide feedback
about recipes and issue warnings where necessary, and correct errors
on cookbook pages, if found.

I am as yet to be convinced about the stability of ZAP, as I have not
seen working implementations of many of the claimed features on a
variety of systems. To say that "Most of it's commands are in full
operation at ZAPsite in the snippets section" is not itself a proof of
stability. ZAP being an add-on module to process PmWiki form input, it
needs to be used in a variety of forms for different purposes, and not
only on www.fast.st/zapbeta, to be evaluated fully.

If "most of the commands" of the code are working on a development site,
one cannot truthfully call it anything more than "beta status".

Also: PmWiki is not in beta status. PmWiki 2.1.27 is available as a
stable release. Only the newest development of PmWiki 2.2.0 is
undergoing a prolonged beta series of releases, which are fairly
stable in themselves, but have required configuration adjustments here
and there by administrators.

>> - Is it safe to use

> No known security vulnerabilities or bugs.  All are fixed as rapidly
> as possible. In some ways it is more secure than other processors as
> it uses session variables for all it's major commands. Plus it has a
> powerful config option which can enable you to completely lock down
> the entire toolbox, and it's fully integrated into PmWiki's security
> system via a custom forms submission password.

I would love to hear other's opinions on this. Especially about the
claim that using session variables makes it more secure.

>> - Do I need to use ZAP or ACME

> The Acme Forms ZAPPING Engine is the name of the recipe. The
> underlying code and scripts continue to be called ZAP.

Meaning Dan has renamed the ZAP cookbook page "Acme". I don't know
what zapping engine is though. Just big meaningless words to me.

>> - What does the future look like

> Only more stability. As PmWiki continues to add features to core, ZAP
> will try its best to fully integrate those changes into its core, as
> it has always done.

Pm has said that he will most likely use {$$varname} syntax for
replacement variables in future in PmWiki. When this comes into
effect I predict ZAP will follow suit and change the {varname} syntax
to {$$varname}. Then all of ZAP's forms need to be modified. Sites
using the old syntax will break. I think it is only fair to mention
this, as Dan has been warned by Pm that the {varname} may very likely
cause conflicts in future with other pieces of PmWiki modules.

>> - Why all these names

> I chose the Acme recipe name in deference to those who think ZAP is
> not too far off from Wiley Coyote's various contraptions. There's also
> a note on the recipe page someone sent me from wikipedia that I
> thought was especially appropriate. Feel free to continue referring to
> it as ZAP if you prefer. Or the Acme ZAPPER or whatever.  It's all
> still the same basic code.

For the record:
Dan was asked by a number of list members to change the name of the
new MarkupExpressionsExtensions recipe to ZapExtensions, and he
answered:
> If you wish, but it tends to get buried down at the bottom of the
> list. I'd rather keep it here, [...]

In a follow on Dr Fred C wrote:
> So long as the pmwiki search engine continues to provide a rather simplistic
> alphabetical listing without attention to relevance, the most viable option for ZAP
> like projects to get proper (or improper) notice might be to consider an "aaZAP" name
> change, or perhaps use the Roadrunner/Wiley Coyote line of reasoning with "AcmeTools"

So we can safely give Dr Fred C credit for the idea to rename the ZAP
page "Acme", and deduct that Dan's prime motive for doing so is to get
ZAP to the top of pagelists in PmWiki. Since the cookbook sidebar is
now showing categories using pagelists I suspect Dan felt ZAP will not get
noticed enough.

But why this overly concern to be noticed? Why this salesman-like
promotion of ZAP?
Dan writes on http://www.fast.st/zapbeta/pmwiki.php
> I am exploring the possibility, however, of developing an alternate
> wiki engine that can run ZAP

So apart from personal reasons I assume there is a business interest
in promoting ZAP. In future you may be able to buy a ZAP Wiki which can
"do absolutely everything", if you believe the sales talk, a la
A.C.M.E.: "a company making everything". It seems to be Dan's goal,
and he is using PmWiki and this community to achieve this.


>> In my book, ZAP appears unreliable for production use.

I second that. I wait for ZAP to show being actually used in a number
of form applications by others, to proof its stability by user
testimonies.

I also wait to see the code itself be written more
transparent for my limited PHP understanding, use much less cryptic
variable names in the code, and comments in the code to explain
functions etc. I think Open Software code is only as good as its
code documentation. But I believe Dan will not do this with ZAP, as
his own business interests for a future salable ZAP Wiki prevents him
from making the code more accessible.

But maybe I will be proofed wrong on this, and ZAP will in future
become reliable, trustworthy and transparent software. It would be
great, and I wish Dan would improve it in that direction, instead of
stopping development half way, because it has fulfilled his
own needs.

  ~Hans




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