[pmwiki-users] a table that is not a table

Petko Yotov 5ko at 5ko.fr
Wed Jun 8 03:39:40 CDT 2016

The HTML table on your page looks no different than other tables. Is it 
possible that the screen reader can detect when a table is used not for 
table data but for layout purposes?

About the documentation, the second phrase of the TableDirectives 
documentation is "All [directives] must be at the beginning of a line to 
have any effect." If there is a better way to document it, we should do 

About selecting markup examples with line breaks: are you able to select 
any other markup examples where line breaks are preserved? It is 
possible that the screen reader converts the linebreaks from table cells 
into spaces (so that you be able to paste them into a spreadsheet), and 
the markup demos on PmWiki are inside table cells.


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On 2016-06-07 04:52, erik burggraaf wrote:
> Hi, I've just delved advanced table directives for the first time with
> I believe a high degree of success.  Two things about this struck me.
> The first thing is that while my table apparently looks and acts like
> a table, my screen reader says it isn't actually a table.  I've
> checked in safari and chrome on my mac.  Neither one reports my table
> as a table.  using special navigation modes I can make it behave sort
> of like a table, but I can't jump directly to my table because it's
> not really official.
> My phone doesn't see it as a table either.  I pulled the page up in
> chrome on my droid and I can feel on my touch screen that the objects
> are as I placed them.  I can even tell how much space there is between
> the smaller elements of the table as the right most column is
> considerably longer than the others.  The phone though, like the
> computer, won't allow me to navigate directly to the table, and it
> won't report cell co-ordinates.  Because of the usecase for this
> particular table, it's probably not a big deal, but I'm curious as to
> whether I may have missed something in my table directive.  The table
> views in the documentation showing the output of the sample code are
> all properly recognized by my screen reader as tables.
> If you want to see the table, click here:
> http://www.erik-burggraaf.com/bum/pmwiki.php?n=About.Resume
> <http://www.erik-burggraaf.com/bum/pmwiki.php?n=About.Resume>
> This page is not ready for public consumption even without the /e
> errors.  I'm working on fixing the typos as we speak.
> The second thing is in the documentation.  There are no
> representations that I could find of line feeds or hard returns.
> For example:
> (:table:) (:cellnr:) contents of 1A (:cell:) contents of cell 1B 
> (:tabelend:)
> Is not the same as:
> (:table:)
> (:cellnr:) contents of cell 1A
> (:cell:) contents of cell 1B
> (:tableend:)
> Without the lines the markup doesn't work, but from a screen reader
> blind point of view, there are no line feeds in the sample code.  It
> didn't kill me.  I bashed it around until it worked, but I'm wondering
> if the line feeds are represented somehow and I'm just missing them?

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